2020 Razer Blade Advanced USB-C PD Charging Issues | Razer Insider

2020 Razer Blade Advanced USB-C PD Charging Issues


Userlevel 2
Hi! Does anyone else have an issue where the 2020 Razer Blade Advanced won't pull over 3A @ 20V (60W) from USB-C (or Thunderbolt 3 over USB-C) when connected to a docking station? I've updated to the latest 1.06 BIOS, latest EC firmware, and reinstalled windows 20H2 with updated thunderbolt drivers and everything. The laptop simply will not pull over 3A over Type-C when connected to a dock. I've tried many docks too, including a Dell WD19TB with 180W PSU (90w advertised power delivery for non-Dell systems), Lenovo Hybrid USB-C Dock (90w advertised PD), and recently a Pluggable TBT3-UDZ, which has a 96W advertised power delivery capability. When any of these docks are plugged into my friend's MacBook Pro, the system reports the correct power delivery capability of the docks. However, my Blade simply won't pull more than 60w, no matter what I try. The only way I've seen to get the Blade to pull anywhere near 5A @ 20V (the limit of the official USB-C Spec) is to use a 100W PD charger and a 5A E-Marked C-C cable.

At first, I thought maybe the E-Markings of the USB-C cables was the issue. So, I tried swapping cables around the docks and the charger brick. Turns out, that wasn't the issue. My findings are in the chart below:




Then, I thought the issue was maybe only with Thunderbolt docks, so I borrowed my brother's Lenovo Hybrid USB-C dock, which is purely a USB Hub (with a DisplayLink chip to drive it's display outputs).... and it was still limited to 60W.



I'm out of ideas. At this point, I think Razer's implementation of USB-PD is just broken. My hypothesis is that the laptop only has one USB-PD profile for >3A, and that profile is explicitly 5A @ 20V. My guess is that the Blade doesn't have other fallback profiles, such as 4.5A (90W), 4.25A(85W), or any other common fallback PD profiles, so it just falls all the way back to the standard 3A profile. This is bad, because dock manufacturers aren't (AFAIK) allowed to advertise 100W USB-PD from their docks. Especially with Thunderbolt docks, where I think the Thunderbolt spec only allows an advertised power delivery capability of 96W or 97W (which is why Pluggable's dock advertises 96W, not 100W). I submitted a support ticket LAST YEAR, and nothing has come of it. They basically told me that I should use a first-party USB-C charger, which kinda defeats the purpose of USB-C, since it's supposed to enable compatibility with a wide range of accessories. This issue applies to my friend's 2020 Blade Stealth as well. He could get 100W from his USB-PD charger brick, but no more than 60W from any kind of dock.

I'm going to buy the new Razer Thunderbolt 4 Chroma dock (90W advertised PD), and see if Razer's own dock can charge their own laptops at the advertised wattage, though I'm kinda expecting it to get stuck at 60W too.

Has anyone else gotten their USB-PD capable Blade laptop to accept over 60W from a USB-C docking station?

BTW, I'm also having the same issue this guy (Here: /blade-15-2020-adv-usb-c-charging-problem.60679/) was having. AND, in his videos, you can see that when he does manage to get his laptop to charge, it charges around 3A @ 20V, which is 60W.

Razer, pls fix.



7/14/21 UPDATE: I bought Razer's In-House Thunderbolt 4 Dock Chroma. It doesn't charge my 2020 Blade 15 Advanced at 90W. It's stuck at 60W, just like the other docks. Razer didn't come up with a proprietary charging protocol addon to USB-PD, they just screwed up their implementation up so badly that their first-party accessories don't even work. :slightly_sad:

10/18/2021 Update: I had contacted Razer support months ago, and they said that they had identified the issue, and that I should wait for a response. It's been a few months, and nothing has come of it. L

This topic has been closed for comments

32 Replies

Userlevel 2
@Pavlogal The EC in the 2020 Blade 15 Advanced is the IT8390VG-256. I can't find anything about this chip online. Though we have had an EC firmware update for this... maybe I can try to look at the binary downloaded from Razer's website, but I have no idea how the ITE firmwares work so not sure that would be terribly useful.
wirelessnet2
@Pavlogal I have a suspicion that the ITE Embedded Controller (EC) is controlling these TPS65987 chips over I2C or something, and that the TPS chips are not actually programmed to handle charging independently.


That is almost certainly the case: https://e2e.ti.com/support/interface-group/interface/f/interface-forum/806741/tps65987ddj-firmware-support

If EC firmware could be reverse engineered that would br great but obviously it wouldn't be an easy feat. Ideally Razer would make their EC firmware open source kinda like System76 but that's never happening. The least I expect from Razer is to fix this issue themselves. If the firmware source code is locked in their hands already they have a duty to maintain it. If we can't fix it ourselves then they have to. I understand that their current focus is on newer laptops but is fixing a PD issue in firmware really that difficult?

Honestly Razer disappointed me. I have a Blade that's usually such an awesome laptop but it has these tiny issues that will never be fixed and support that doesn't care. I really hope Framework realeases a 15-16" laptop with a replaceable GPU. If that happens I am SOLD.
Userlevel 2
The TPS65987 firmware probably has some hash or checksum or something that prevents me from just editing parts of it. There's a few options to move from here:

1. Try to talk to the TPS chips over I2C. If we can do that then maybe we can force them to do things we want.
2. Try to access the hardware I2C debug interface of the TPS chips. I assume this would require soldering wires onto the motherboard. Not great.
3. Dump the firmware (already done), correctly edit it (stuck here), and then flash this firmware back to the SPI memory connected to each of the TPS chips (easy).

If anyone wants to try help pls dm me thanks
Userlevel 2
@Pavlogal Razer admitted that the laptop has issues with charging. They told me they were able to reproduce the issue in their lab. That was like a year ago. They probably will never release a fix. Which is why I will never buy another Razer laptop. Piss poor support.

The 2020 Blade 15 Advanced uses the Texas Instruments TPS65987DDJ USB-C controller for both USB-C ports. They have separate firmwares. I dumped the firmware for the TPS65987DDJ connected to the Thunderbolt-enabled port and tried to reverse-engineer the region of the firmware that normally holds the USB-PD Sink Capabilities, but it looks empty, or I'm just bad at reverse engineering stuff. I have a suspicion that the ITE Embedded Controller (EC) is controlling these TPS65987 chips over I2C or something, and that the TPS chips are not actually programmed to handle charging independently.

I've abandoned the reverse engineering effort for now, as college is kinda killing me.
Just checking is this still being worked on? I also have a Blade Advanced 2020 and USB-C charging was always funky. I got a 100W GaN charger and an e-marked cable but charging only works *sometimes*. When booted up plugging into the left (non-TB) port will sometimes randomly work, literally no idea why it's not consistent. Plugging in first and then booting up works almost always. The right (TB3) port never worked (for charging).

For me it either works or it doesn't and I never established the charging speed because I don't have a way to measure it.

I also saw your reply on notebookreview forums asking for pics of USB-PD ICs to try to get around Razer's propriotary bs. First I gotta say that's unfathomably based and awesome and thanks for bringing that up.

Either way, I'm just asking if there's any news and I'm considering getting a USB-PD protocol analyzer and CH341a programmer and do some testing myself. It will take a while for those things to ship though.
I'm really glad I found this thread. I've been trying to work out for ages why my 90W Dell TB dock and my 90W Dell USB-C charger wasn't getting close to running the system at idle, let alone doing anything intensive.

I was dismayed by the fact there was nothing built into the internal software, power profile-wise that realises the system is on USB-C power and adjusts performance in-line with the power delivery. It's either battery or mains, which is completely pointless if the "mains" the system is scaling for is 230W and it's actualy getting 60W.

I can see the battery just start draining by the percentage in real time when this occurs until the laptop just runs out of power and turns off.

Dell do have a 130W USB-C charger out at this point which I'm sure supports 20V @ 5A (£68 - Amazon) so I think I'll invest in that and see if it makes any difference. Perhaps the system will have a better change of lasting a tad longer @ 100W then 60W - but in general, I agree that Razer seem to have made the biggest possible screw up in regard to implementing USB PD, from both a hardware and a bios/software perspective.

The only thing it is useful for is charging the laptop when completely turned off which pretty much defeats the entire point of it, made even more hilarious when the same thing appears to happen when docked to their own products.
Userlevel 2
As of right now, no Thunderbolt certified docks will charge the laptop at any rate over 60W. If someone somehow manages to sneak a true 100W power delivery dock past Intel certification, I'd assume it would work. I have contacted Razer support, and they said they have identified the issue, and they are apparently working on a fix, though I have no clue how long that would take.

If you want to try some docks, I'd maybe try to find a USB-C/Displayport Alt Mode (NOT THUNDERBOLT) dock that advertises true 100W USB-PD. I haven't tried one of those yet, but I think it should actually deliver the full 100W.
keep us posted, please.
I really don't need the TB4/chroma dock (yet!) so I would be interested in what works in terms of Thunderbolt and PD

What I need is a docking station that
- powers the 15" blade (2020, base model, GTX1660) laptop
- can provide pixels to at least one 4K@60Hz screen
- does proper networking and can connect 3 or 4 USB devices.(charge&sync my phone, headphones etc..)

my plan is to start with the "amazon basics" 11-in-1 thunderbolt 3 dock - it claims to deliver 60W to the laptop - cost is ~EUR 100,- so that would be a steal if it works.

If not, then I will work my way up to Anker "powerexpand elite" thunderbolt dock (it claims to do 85W PD via TB3) - pricetag is ~EUR 300,-
Alternatievely there is the Anker Apex TB4 dock, it claims to deliver 90W PD to the laptop. Same price tag.

There is an i-Tec TB dock that claims 3x4K screens and 96W PD - but I don't know the brand, that would be ~EUR 250,-

If all else fails there is the Razer chroma dock.. but if it is really stuck at 60W as @wirelessnet2 reports, then it's not worth the ~EUR330,- price tag IMO

sadly there seems to be nothing in between 100 and 300 euros.. except aliexpress stuff which is notoriously bad at receiving aftercare / driver / firmware updates.
Userlevel 2
Yeah thread is still technically alive. Razer support said they identified the issue and are working on a fix. If it will ever come... idk.
This thread still alive?
I just got my Razer USB-C 100W GaN charger and I too see the 60W limit charging my RB14. Odd behaviour us that I get more like 80W if I boot with it connected, but revert to 60W if I unplug and plug it back in.
Userlevel 2
I bought Razer's own Thunderbolt 4 Dock Chroma for testing. Guess what? It doesn't charge my Blade 15 at 90w. It's also stuck at 60w. Razer screwed up their implementation of USB-PD so badly that their own dock doesn't work properly with their own laptop. wtf
Userlevel 2
Base0x02
Sorry if you've checked this but there is a Allow USB Charging option in the bios that was disabled by default on my laptop. I've got it enabled and its charing with my apple USB-C charger.


IIRC that option is for the USB-A ports. Anyways, I have that enabled.
Sorry if you've checked this but there is a Allow USB Charging option in the bios that was disabled by default on my laptop. I've got it enabled and its charing with my apple USB-C charger.
Userlevel 2
SupaFlanka
Thanks a lot for the information so far everyone! Great analyses.
Current I am using a Baseus 120W GaN charger rated 20V-5A with a 2m 100W cable from same brand as well.
https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Baseus-Adapter-MacBook-Surface/dp/B08G85BWSN
Did a basic check/test with a voltage reader and indeed, couldn't achieve more than 60W for some reason.
Will conduct further tests if anyone is interested.



Wow that's strange. I could at least get 100W from a 100W USB-PD charger. If you're sure that your cable is a 5A rated cable, then I guess the charger isn't advertising 5A @ 20V.

I really need to get a good USB-PD protocol analyzer. Will probably go with Cypress's CY4500.
Thanks a lot for the information so far everyone! Great analyses.
Current I am using a Baseus 120W GaN charger rated 20V-5A with a 2m 100W cable from same brand as well.
https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Baseus-Adapter-MacBook-Surface/dp/B08G85BWSN
Did a basic check/test with a voltage reader and indeed, couldn't achieve more than 60W for some reason.
Will conduct further tests if anyone is interested.
Userlevel 2
I will contact customer service and see if they are willing to issue a firmware patch if I find that the dock is not advertising a 5A @ 20V profile. The SD5600T looks exactly like the Plugable TBT3-UDZ, which uses a Cypres EZ-PD CCG5C USB-PD solution. These chips have really easily upgradable firmwares over I2C.
Userlevel 2
Update: I got the Kensington dock, and it does not charge at 100w. I'm guessing their marketing was wrong, but I'm going to analyze the dock's power delivery profiles and see. Expecting to see a 96W or 97W PDO, and not an actual 5A @ 20V profile.
Userlevel 2
Kensington has released a Thunderbolt 3 dock with 100W PD. https://www.kensington.com/p/products/device-docking-connectivity-products/laptop-docks-usb-accessories/sd5600t-thunderbolt-3-and-usb-c-dual-4k-hybrid-docking-station-100w-pd-winmac/
Userlevel 2
dudepare01
I was able to utilize the PD charging on my Blade Pro 17 2020 and the battery remained fully charged with light use (browsing, netfilx etc.). Used a 100w GAN charger.

100W chargers work. I said that in the original post. It's docks that are the main issue. There aren't any Thunderbolt-certified docks that have a 100W PDO in their USB-PD firmwares. It's not allowed.
I was able to utilize the PD charging on my Blade Pro 17 2020 and the battery remained fully charged with light use (browsing, netfilx etc.). Used a 100w GAN charger.
Userlevel 2
EvilEnslaver
I've tried blupeak and Lenovo docks with PD as well as some USB chargers rated at 100W, and none worked, yet they worked with my ThinkPad.
Also tried a few different cables JIC, but was also a failure.

The whole proprietary restricting to only razer products is why I'll my next laptop won't be a razer branded one.

Of anyone develops a hack device to get around it, please be sure to let us know.



I agree the proprietary stuff is BS. With regards to chargers, just make sure you get a charger that explicitly supports 5A @ 20V = 100W. Your charger needs to have this exact USB-PD profile for the Blade to pull 100W.
Also make sure you have a proper 5A-rated USB C-C cable. I have this charger and it works at 100W:

https://www.amazon.com/hyppr-100W-Charger-Foldable-Black/dp/B088666T68/ref=sr_1_5?crid=29X17S48RH8G&dchild=1&keywords=hyppr+100w&qid=1623419846&sprefix=hyppr%2Caps%2C173&sr=8-5

Unfortunately, there are no docks that I know of that explicitly have a 5A @ 20V USB-PD profile. Especially Thunderbolt docks. The thunderbolt specification requires that the charger does not exceed 100W of power delivered for more than 5 seconds, so most Thunderbolt dock manufacturers build in some margin by advertising 96W or 97W charging. For more information, here's the FAQ page for the dock I have (Plugable TBT3-UDZ):



They say "We are unaware of any real-world scenarios where this will affect charging behavior," but unfortunately you get companies like Razer that pull stupid BS...

I'm in talks with the dock manufacturer to see if they can release a "Beta" or "Experimental" firmware that adds a 5A @ 20V profile. They are reluctant, since this would break their IEC and Thunderbolt spec compliance, but I'm still hopeful. Unfortunately this process is slow since they used a Cypress USB-PD solution (Cypress makes ICs and other components), and Plugable tells me the firmware update would need to be created by Crypress, and then given to Plugable to distribute. Ugh
Userlevel 2
Brastic
Since the USB-C charging was not office for the 2020 laptops, I held back from buying one. Now that the 2021 laptops are coming out and support USB-C charging, I am already planning on getting one.


I have a 2020 Blade 15 Advanced. 2080Super MaxQ and 10875H. It has USB-PD support (well, kinda.) A big reason I got the 2020 was because of this feature, since I would be going to college, and I didn't want to lug around the 230W brick.

Unfortunately COVID happened, and I barely had any in-person classes, so I couldn't even take advantage of my USB-C charger, but hopefully that will change this upcoming semester. Rip freshman year lol
Userlevel 7
Brastic
Since the USB-C charging was not office for the 2020 laptops, I held back from buying one. Now that the 2021 laptops are coming out and support USB-C charging, I am already planning on getting one.

2020 advanced 15 and pro 17 has usb c with power delivery. Though 2021 model 11gen cpu, both usb c has power delivery function, which’s nice to have.
Since the USB-C charging was not office for the 2020 laptops, I held back from buying one. Now that the 2021 laptops are coming out and support USB-C charging, I am already planning on getting one.
I've tried blupeak and Lenovo docks with PD as well as some USB chargers rated at 100W, and none worked, yet they worked with my ThinkPad.
Also tried a few different cables JIC, but was also a failure.

The whole proprietary restricting to only razer products is why I'll my next laptop won't be a razer branded one.

Of anyone develops a hack device to get around it, please be sure to let us know.