Symbols/ Flipped

PezzyDude
Hi all. I've already checked with Razer Tech Support on this, but, the answer they gave was not exactly enlightening; perhaps one of you could shed some light on this :big_grin_: I had the Ornata Chroma Keyboard. What I'm about to describe was not something I originally caught when ordering it (I ordered it through Amazon.com, but even in the pics on their site, I did not catch this). This was not something that hit me.....occurred to me until after the keyboard was physically in front of me and I started using it. And even then....it slowly and subtly hit me.... Above the top row of letters (QWERTY.....) where the numbers are, from left to right, 1, 2, 3......8, 9, 0, there are also the symbols on these keys: 1 is paired with !; 2 is paired with @; 3 is paired with #, and so on. However.....they are flipped, or, inverted, as opposed to the standard keyboard style that has been around for decades. Here's a pic of the top row of numbers from a standard keyboard: https://s289.photobucket.com/user/PezzyDude/media/QWERTY-Keyboard_zps2pm8nbt3.jpg.html And here's the top row of numbers from the Razer keyboard: https://s289.photobucket.com/user/PezzyDude/media/razer-ornata-chroma-keyboard_zpsik8p65l7.jpg.html Do you see what I'm referring to? On a standard keyboard that has been around for YEARS, on the Number keys, the number itself is at the bottom of the key, and the symbol is at the top. With the Razer keyboard, it is flipped/ inverted. And, this is not just true of the Number/ Symbol keys, but on any symbol key on the entire keyboard: the semi-colon and colon (; :); the apostrophe and quotation mark (' "); the forward slash and question mark (/ ?); etc. They've all been flipped from what a standard keyboard has had for years. The way it's supposed to be is this: On the Number keys, for example, if you want the symbol on that key and not the number, you press the Shift key and then that "number", but, you'll receive the symbol. Let's say you want the money/ dollar symbol, so, you press the Shift key and the "4" key, but you'll receive the "$" symbol. Because, as you'll notice, the Shift key has a symbol on it, the symbol of an upwards pointing arrowhead, meaning: You're shifting Up. With the example I gave, you want the money/ dollar symbol, so you should be shifting up to it: the 4 should be at the bottom of the key, and the $ symbol should be at the top. Yes, I'm a gamer, but, I'm also a bit <ahem>....."older", and I've been using a keyboard before computers were even a thing, as I've even used a typewriter back in the day :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye_: The way I've described number/ symbol keys has been the way it's been for a WHILE, decades & decades. I mentioned that Razer Tech Support's answer was not exactly enlightening when I asked them about this, as to why their keyboards are this way (and not just the Ornata Chroma, but their other keyboards as well). Here's their reply: "Yes, this design is the same for all our gaming keyboards and laptops. We can't get into the specifics but let's just say that most hardcore gamers prefer how it is today". I don't know why they said that, that they "can't get into the specifics", as if it's some closely guarded company secret. But do any of you know why? Why the change in flipping/ inverting the symbol keys? And....what is meant by "most hardcore gamer's prefer how it is today"? Thanks for any info in enlightening me :rolleyes: Pez

xCryptik
Hi PezzyDude, It is because the LED light is not at the bottom side but at the top side most probably? It would be less light that shines thru the key if those symbol is the other way around.

JulianKapa
I'm thinking it could be because the numbers are the "primary" keys while the symbols are the "secondary" keys. My Razer keyboard doesn't have arrows on the shift keys (not sure about other Razer keyboards). Couldn't they turn the switches around, so the light is at the bottom? Or maybe that would just add unnecessary complexity.

PezzyDude
Thanks for the replies everyone. xCryptik: I think I hear what you're saying: That the light "bulb" (the LED) is located towards the top of the keycap? And that that's why Razer "flipped" the location of the numbers/ symbols on the keycap so the light shining through the keycap lights up the number better? Do I have that correct? :wink_: I've never pulled a cap off of a key so I don't know for sure if that's true. And if it were true, then why did they make that their design, to locate the light/ LED at the top of the keycap and not the bottom? Because if this was deliberate by design (the light/ LED at the top of keycap), then they had to make that other adjustment to compensate for the light to shine through better, the adjustment of "flipping" all of the numbers/ symbols from the standard that has been around for years. And not just the number/ symbol keys, because as I mentioned in my original post, it's other symbol keys, too: The semi-colon and colon (; :) the apostrophe and quotation mark (' "); the forward slash and question mark (/ ?). However, there might be something to all of this regarding gaming-type keyboards; it may not be just Razer. I took a look over at Logitech, and many of their gaming keyboards do the same thing.....but not all. Here's one called the Logitech G910 that has the number/ symbol keys "normal": https://www.logitechg.com/en-us/products/gaming-keyboards/g910-orion-rgb-gaming-keyboard.920-008012.html JulianKapa: You mentioned "My Razer keyboard doesn't have arrows on the shift keys". Whoops, my mistake :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye_: I had been looking at some other pics online of standard QWERTY keyboards, plus, I don't have the Razer Ornata Chroma Keyboard in front of me anymore. Plus, even with the old-fashioned typewriter, the Shift key would have that upwards pointing arrow on it. Because like I mentioned in my original post, when you press the Shift key, it's like you're shifting "up", because whatever is at the bottom of the key (1,2,3, 4 or ; ' , .), you don't want that, so you're shifting up to what's up above it (!, @, #, $ or : " < >). xCryptik: One more thing; you said "There's switches that is another way around usually on custom keyboard or other manufacturers". I'm not quite sure what you meant by that at all; please clarify? Thanks, Pez

PezzyDude
Thanks for the replies everyone. xCryptik: I think I hear what you're saying: That the light "bulb" (the LED) is located towards the top of the keycap? And that that's why Razer "flipped" the location of the numbers/ symbols on the keycap so the light shining through the keycap lights up the number better? Do I have that correct? :wink_: I've never pulled a cap off of a key so I don't know for sure if that's true. And if it were true, then why did they make that their design, to locate the light/ LED at the top of the keycap and not the bottom? Because if this was deliberate by design (the light/ LED at the top of keycap), then they had to make that other adjustment to compensate for the light to shine through better, the adjustment of "flipping" all of the numbers/ symbols from the standard that has been around for years. And not just the number/ symbol keys, because as I mentioned in my original post, it's other symbol keys, too: The semi-colon and colon (; :) the apostrophe and quotation mark (' "); the forward slash and question mark (/ ?). However, there might be something to all of this regarding gaming-type keyboards; it may not be just Razer. I took a look over at Logitech, and many of their gaming keyboards do the same thing.....but not all. Here's one called the Logitech G910 that has the number/ symbol keys "normal": https://www.logitechg.com/en-us/products/gaming-keyboards/g910-orion-rgb-gaming-keyboard.920-008012.html JulianKapa: You mentioned "My Razer keyboard doesn't have arrows on the shift keys". Whoops, my mistake :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye_: I had been looking at some other pics online of standard QWERTY keyboards, plus, I don't have the Razer Ornata Chroma Keyboard in front of me anymore. Plus, even with the old-fashioned typewriter, the Shift key would have that upwards pointing arrow on it. Because like I mentioned in my original post, when you press the Shift key, it's like you're shifting "up", because whatever is at the bottom of the key (1,2,3, 4 or ; ' , .), you don't want that, so you're shifting up to what's up above it (!, @, #, $ or : " < >). xCryptik: One more thing; you said "There's switches that is another way around usually on custom keyboard or other manufacturers". I'm not quite sure what you meant by that at all; please clarify? Thanks, Pez